red_satin_doll: (Servalan Blakes7)
[personal profile] red_satin_doll
1) The beat that my heart skipped: Congratulations to the winners of [livejournal.com profile] btvs_hush challenge #272: [livejournal.com profile] dragonydreams, [livejournal.com profile] rua1412 and [livejournal.com profile] debris4spike for their superb entries. I looked at those entries the other day when I was voting and was so excited I almost forgot to breathe for a second. No, I'm not kidding. (Yes, I do need to get a life but never mind that right now.) They were all so much of a piece with one another; delicately atmospheric and melancholy, aesthetically pleasing and intellectually engaging. I wanted to know who made each of them and HOW, for goodness sakes; what were the artists thinking at the time, and how closely if at all do my perceptions match what they hoped to achieve.

Deadline for challenge 273 is Tuesday May 20th.

I never guessed that the Willow icon was Deborah's. She's a wonderful artist (see the Servalan icon I snagged for confirmation); but I thought I "knew" her style in general. This icon is on another level entirely. It suggests feminine mysteries revealed, from within a cave, the womb or a strange ansd rare flower. Becoming, but tenatively so. Rua's icon is a bit more subtle visually and I almost overlooked it at first; but there really aren't many nice Xander icons out there that I've seen, and I slowly fell in love with it. Which is a big deal because I'm not easily drawn to images of men, and Xander is an interesting character but hardly my favorite. This icon makes me want to cry; good lord, the expression on his face. He's so terribly young to be so old. He seems middle-aged already (is that what happens to children growing up in a war zone?) The effect at the corner reminds me both of a watercolor painting and the corner of a newspaper tossed on the curb. Old-tea coloring.

And likewise Dragony's Giles icon - so, so old, so melancholy; autumnal, fading, isolated. A reluctant parental-figure who was himself poorly-parented but is somehow expected to guide these children; a Watcher whose emotions and intellect are at constant war with one another, neither side quite winning out in the end; a man who wants love, who wants to connect but has no idea how, and who thrusts family and love away each time it comes to him because it's all he knows to do.

You may be shocked to read that #5 in that challenge was my alternate choice; I have no idea who made that one. Yes, I came within a hairsbreath of voting for a Bangel icon - of the EoD/Chosen kiss, no less. It's a simple crop - no distractions, the golden background gentle pushed back from the figures; the visual platonic idea of a "kiss" in our culture. You needn't even know the characters, the fandom or the context to get that far. A good icon starts with a good image. But again, this is muted, slightly hazy; the autumnal coloring suggests a relationshipp that exists somewhere between the lands of "perhaps someday" and "never will again".

2) I feel much the same sense of excitement looking at the entries for  [livejournal.com profile] slayerstillness challenge # 24 :the pleasure of trying to decode the icons, sift through the layers of meaning and intent - so much to unpack here. Voting deadline is Tuesday May 20 so do vote now, if you can bear making a decision. Again, very much an "all of a piece" feeling to the entries, which is all the more astonishing given the fact that the prompt was a "free for all". The artists could submit anything they liked, so I'd expect, well, a free-for-all in the literal visual sense - and yet a sense of (inter)connection is very much apparent here. Muted colors, subtle textures, the importance of line. Certain characters and themes are much in evidence: Willow and Giles, Bangel and Spuffy are all present and accounted for. I have a few favorites but I'll reserve gushing until after the winners are announced.

3) Sign ups for round 1 of [livejournal.com profile] btvsats20in20 icontest are now open - the deadline is June 4th, and themes can be found here. The comm is still open to anyone wishing to be a co-mod or banner maker. Thank you to [livejournal.com profile] debris4spike for making sure this was on my radar, and to [livejournal.com profile] bangel_4e for going above and beyond in answering all my questions and offering support, advice and feedback. [livejournal.com profile] oh_cheezit has posted her S7 Spike, Spufffy and Beneath You icons for this first round: SO LOVELY.

I don't know yet if I'll sign up for this round; I'm still taking my time learning about these 20in20 challenges; they seem daunting to me, but so did [livejournal.com profile] slayerstillness, [livejournal.com profile] otherworldlyric and [livejournal.com profile] btvs_hush at first. icontests have definitely pushed me to improve my own work both by doing and by the example of other artists.


4) Due to lack of entries [livejournal.com profile] dragonydreams extended Otherworldlyrics challenge 172 extended one more week - and you know what that means: I will be nibbling my fingers anxiously until May 23rd second-guessing the entries I sent in the other day and wondering "Should I switch one? I should totally switch one. No, I shouldn't. Yes, I should dear god the freakin' agony (was that supposed to be a secret? Um....) We all have one more week to get in our entries inspired by the Cure's "Watching Me Fall".

I had to read the lyrics of that song a couple of times before it sunk what was going on in it: a guy describing himself pick up a prostitute in Tokyo as is he's having an out of body experience. (Hey, I've never hired a sex worker, so what would I know?) She's described as if she were a stereotypical movie hooker, a doll, a siren or seductress rather than a human being - and he's the one "falling". Ok, so this guy has an itch to scratch and the money to buy himself an hour with a sex worker who is totally dehumanized in the song and he's complaining? Waa-waa, poor little me with my male priviledge and superior economic status and yet I'm morally helpless...oh give me an effing break. This is stuff is straight out of Genesis. Hey, dude, here's an idea if you're feeling dehumanized by the experience: start by treating the sex worker you hired for the hour as another human being.  Knowwhatimean?

Honestly, that song is just begging to be deconstructed. Possibly with a sledgehammer shovel a few well-made icons.

Date: 2014-05-20 01:19 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] velvetwhip.livejournal.com
The icons at Hush really were splendid. Have to agree completely!

I love these posts of yours. I really do. You're so passionate and intelligent.


Gabrielle

Date: 2014-05-20 02:15 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] red-satin-doll.livejournal.com
I love these posts of yours. I really do.

Oh gosh, THANK YOU for that feedback! I really worry that I'm being too long-winded or incomprehensible, or that I need to be shorter, etc. So knowing that you enjoy them means so much to me, it really does.

I had to cut it short when I started gushing about my favorites at the Slayerstillness round - when the voting is over THERE WILL BE GUSHING. FOUNTAINS OF GUSH.

Date: 2014-05-20 01:22 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] dragonydreams.livejournal.com
I'm honored you liked the Bangel icon so much, despite the pairing. It was mine too.

Date: 2014-05-20 01:47 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] red-satin-doll.livejournal.com
*applause*

(Now I'm wondering if you also made any of the Bangel icons in slayerstillness which I may or may not have voted for *17* but I know you can't say so I'll just have to wait until after the winners are announced. I can be patient.)

I've really been aware lately that I've been unable to make any Bangel icons and I want to. The Anne icons I made for the last round of Slayerstillness were meant to be Bangel icons. Full disclosure: I did ship them in S2 when I watched the show two years ago. Buffy wanted to be with him, I wanted her to be happy. Simple. Even watching The Prom, I kept thinking "Dude, stay with her."

I can't get on board the "Relationship X should be the endgame for Buffy." I prefer "I like Buffy with Character X" or "I like this character/actor better personally". It's not a contest. But I'm kind of an outlier when it comes to shipping, I guess.

Date: 2014-05-20 11:59 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] dragonydreams.livejournal.com
*bows*

I don't belong to slayerstillness, so no, those wouldn't be mine.

I don't ship Buffy at all. Honestly, I didn't really like her a lot of the time, especially in later seasons, so I didn't care who she dated. (Except I really didn't like her with Spike.) I did all my shipping around Willow and Giles (either together or with other people).

Date: 2014-05-21 12:08 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] red-satin-doll.livejournal.com
I did all my shipping around Willow and Giles (either together or with other people).

Oh thank god you don't ship Buffy/Giles because I do NOT GET THAT one at all. i don't understand why Willow/Giles isn't more of a thing because it's canon she had a crush on him - the way she looks up at him in the early seasons, come on! I figured that out on my own.

It's weird but I can ship Giles with Joyce, Jenny, Willow, Olivia AND Anya; and Willow, I'm pretty flexible. Male, female, I can go either way and Willow is pretty darn shippable with just about everyone. I think it's Aly's charisma (I can see it on HIMYM - when Lily "jokes" about having a thing for Robin I'm not sure it's a joke.) I don't ship either of them with Buffy. Go figure.

Date: 2014-05-21 12:15 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] dragonydreams.livejournal.com
I ship Giles with just about everyone except Buffy. I've written him with Willow, Oz, Ethan and Spike. Willow I've written with Giles, Oz, Spike, Angel, Lindsey. I like both of them with Xander too, but haven't written that.

Date: 2014-05-21 12:24 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] red-satin-doll.livejournal.com
I forgot about Ethan! *slaps forehead* And yeah Giles and Buffy shipping is a big DNW for me.

Weirdly enough I find Willow more interesting either by herself or in the pairings you mention than with any of her canon lovers. I also ship her with Riley in S4, but only so I can kill him off instead of Tara *wicked cackle* And conversely I am more interested in Oz and Tara for themselves than as willow's partners.

Date: 2014-05-20 01:44 am (UTC)
ext_106804: (Default)
From: [identity profile] teragramm.livejournal.com
I have to say I haven't entered any icon challenges this week. *shrugs* Maybe next week

Date: 2014-05-20 01:51 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] red-satin-doll.livejournal.com
Maybe next week

It kind of goes in waves for me. I know i entered OWL *shhhh* but apparently no one else did? I'd like to enter the hush challenge (haven't done hush since last August) but the deadline is tomorrow, so I don't know.

I just hate having to wait for results, y'know?

Date: 2014-05-20 01:58 am (UTC)
ext_106804: (Default)
From: [identity profile] teragramm.livejournal.com
I just hate having to wait for results, y'know? Yep, I absolutely know

Date: 2014-05-20 06:55 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] rua1412.livejournal.com
Oh my stars! You make me blush with your words about my icon.

Thank you!

Date: 2014-05-20 04:15 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] red-satin-doll.livejournal.com
My pleasure, hon; its a beautiful icon so the compliments are well-deserved!

Date: 2014-05-20 08:26 am (UTC)
debris4spike: (Buffy - Wishing on a star)
From: [personal profile] debris4spike
I wish I knew this Deborah you were describing ... her art sounds great ... if only I could do things like that!!!! I loved that image of Buffy & Angel (and that says a lot!!)

I wish I had your patience for experimentation, for testing colours, tones, lights & shades ... you humble me with the range of beauty you can get out of one mini image.

With the 20in20, if you want to sign up ... now or next time, and ever want hints as to themes/ideas etc ... you only have to ask. Someone helped me when I started ... and I think in helping others, you learn yourself.

I admire you doing the lyric challenge ... that is always one that I dread coming up on a 20in20 prompt!

Enjoy your day.

Date: 2014-05-20 04:29 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] red-satin-doll.livejournal.com
Oh surely you know her? I must introduce you then I'm sure the two of you will get on FAMOUSLY. :D That was a most excellent icon, sweetie. Well done - you deserve all the praise that comes your way. (And your old art teacher deserves a solid scolding, but they got theirs I'm sure.)

And you honor me with your compliments, truly. You make my hours of procrastination (and indecision) sound so much nicer than they warrent!

Have you voted in Slayerstillness yet? Some of my favorite icons in it are the Buffy/Angel icons, really brilliant work. I would love to be able to make one myself that I was happy with. I have tried making a B/A icon and failed - I've even tried making an Angel icon, still failed. Men are very, very hard for me to even look at. I get bored really fast. I need to look at my issues, apparently.

Thanks again for the tips! Bangel_4e was most helpful. I might enter the Hush challenge, haven't done that since last August.

I admire you doing the lyric challenge ... that is always one that I dread coming up on a 20in20 prompt!

Getting the text right is hard but once I hit upon an idea it's such fun! I find the lyric challenges easier than the Hush challenges that provide specific caps you have to work with, because I might try out a bit of the lyrics with several different images from different seasons and really let my imagination go with it. But perhaps because I'm a writer first and have always been more word oriented anyway.

If I can ever offer any help, let me know.

Date: 2014-05-20 07:24 pm (UTC)
debris4spike: (Just Believe - Josph from V)
From: [personal profile] debris4spike
I have voted ... and will admit there are some amazing images. I find myself picking my choices, then going back and trying to spot which ones could be yours! Will admit that it is only recently in the Hush and Stillness comps that I have attempted an Angel icon ... and have yet to make a Xander one!

I have done something for Hush this evening, but a couple were a bit rushed ... and then I can't get your patience and work on it ... I just close my eyes and enter!

Date: 2014-05-20 11:53 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] red-satin-doll.livejournal.com
I find myself picking my choices, then going back and trying to spot which ones could be yours!

Really? Oh, thanks! Although up until now it can't have been very hard to do. Now that I'm trying out ipiccy (thanks kwritten!) it might get a bit harder. Every time I go in it I find something new that I can do. (Remembering what I did is the issue.)

I used to try to guess who did what and after getting it terribly wrong a couple of times I gave up on that. Although I am wondering who did the Willow icon #1, which makes a great compliment to your Hush icon, and at least three of the Bangel icons.

And while I've got you here, how in the world did you make that Willow icon? Really, was that a texture or a layer? I don't know PS but I'm trying to learn a little because some of it is applicable to ipiccy. What were your other entries?

only recently in the Hush and Stillness comps that I have attempted an Angel icon ... and have yet to make a Xander one!

You've made some very strong Angel icons - and as far as Xander goes, I've only made one (with two variants) from Restless.

I did some things for Hush too but believe me they were rushed and not brilliant in the least - I deleted a few tries, they were that bad. And then I went back and forth and back and forth on what to enter. I finally decided that if I LOVE an icon, I'd best submit my second choice.

I'm sure yours will be marvelous.

I made something gorgeous that I didn't submit because I think it uses an effect that's against the rules. I'm trying to decide whether to hold it back for another challenge or just show it off regardless.

One thing I discovered with ipiccy today was the sharpening tool, which is MUCH better than PB's version; I had no idea just how out of focus my icons really were until I tried it.


Date: 2014-05-21 06:58 pm (UTC)
debris4spike: (Spike - with white frame)
From: [personal profile] debris4spike
Haven't seen ipiccy ... On GIMP there is a sharpening tool, and as you have noted most screencaps need a basic sharpen ... that is usually my first job!

The Willow image was used by adding a frame ... I had a lot of help when I had to use them for a StarTrek 20in20, and that was one of the frames I had to use! It is plain white, so I added colour to the outer 3/4, to give a different image. So I worked on the 2 images, then copied the frame to use as a 2nd layer over the basic. The icon I'm using here of Spike was with the same frame, but kept in white.

Date: 2014-05-27 12:16 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] red-satin-doll.livejournal.com
Usually sharpening is one of the first things I do, and do it a bit more as I downsize gradually but the ipiccy sharpening tool is a world away from PB's - I had no idea how fuzzy a lot of my icons really were! (When I post about the btvs_hush entries I'll put up examples of what I mean.)

You really did a marvelous job adding color to the frame of the Willow icon! I prefer it to the plain white - so sophisticated! You're doing some phenomenal work.

And congratulations on your win at btvs_hush! The winners also happen to be the icons I voted for, including yours - it was the first one that caught my eye. Lovely colors, diagonal composition, shading, all in perfect balance; great sharpness and clarity; and the co-ordinated edge along the left and bottom was a great finishing touch. a bit of decoration without seeming too much.

I actually thought the Spike one by Rua_1412 might possibly be yours but I wasn't sure. Or possibly the Joyce one? But now I'm thinking the Angel one because you remarked on what a great shot it was. I actually tried to make an icon from that, it has all the elements of a great icon - strong image, rich darks - but couldn't.

Mine are #4, 8 and 10 - one of Buffy, two of Willow.
http://btvs-hush.livejournal.com/284929.html
I want to put up a post about the slayerstillness icons first, so hopefully I can do the btvs_hush one tomorrow.


Date: 2014-05-27 10:18 am (UTC)
debris4spike: (Spike - two faces)
From: [personal profile] debris4spike
Hadn't guesses that the last one was yours ... but thought the others were ... you are great are experimenting with colours and tones. The Angel one I ended up keeping really simple - any much work would have lost the image, so it was more of a "crop & tidy" than icon making!

Yes, (shock!!) the Angel one was mine ... as was the Joyce one. I also did one of Buffy but it had text ... oooops! I was working on some 20in20 as well and they had to have text, so I just carried on with the words.

My Spike 20in20 are up here... I shall be interested in your thoughts on the work ... one or two I was not happy with, but I know its because I didn't really experiment with colours etc.

Date: 2014-05-27 06:59 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] red-satin-doll.livejournal.com
Hadn't guesses that the last one was yours ... but thought the others were .

I did a LOT of variations of the Buffy one, the red Willow icon was a happy medium - not the most stylized nor realistic of the batch. I think I like extremes of stylization more than most people do? (I think you do as well, with your black and white line drawing icons.) The last one I also had abstracted versions of, but I just loved the way her eye looked in that one, the very clean black and white of it.

I thought someone might think the Joyce was mine - it looks very much like other icons I have done, and I admired the perfect balance of darks and lights in it. I did wonder if it was yours. What about the naturalistic Spike icon?

any much work would have lost the image, so it was more of a "crop & tidy" than icon making!

Exactly, the image is already fantastic, adding anything is gilding the lily. I tried to do an Angel icon much like yours, except cropping much closer to the face. I couldn't do it. Male faces and bodies are hard for me - I get uncomfortable or disinterested very quickly. And I might think the actor very handsome or have enjoyed the performance and admire them. But working with stills is another matter.

OTOH, Rua's Spike icon that looked like a painting had me staring at it, wanting to know how that look was achieved. I admire people who can capture men in their icons, I'm just not there yet.

you are great are experimenting with colours and tones

Oh thanks! But some of the time I spend playing with color variations could perhaps be better spent on learning how to improve the clarity of my images, doing layers and textures and so forth. Or it could be more profitably spent doing housework....Nah.

I was working on some 20in20 as well and they had to have text, so I just carried on with the words.

I feel your pain! I was working on three different challenges at the same time and got really confused what I was doing for what sometimes!

And I just peeked at your icons - YAY! Wonderful work. I shall leave my thoughts on your journal tonight or tomorrow, promise.

Date: 2014-05-27 08:06 pm (UTC)
debris4spike: (Just Believe - Josph from V)
From: [personal profile] debris4spike
No - shock, horror, no Spike from me!

To me the male body has lovely lines ... it is the shaping and toning that draws me in. I want to highlight those, and tend to prefer the softer image of a female .... so that one of Joyce was typical of that theory.

Date: 2014-05-27 08:48 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] red-satin-doll.livejournal.com
No Spike???


I've been looking for an excuse to use this gif.

To me the male body has lovely lines ... it is the shaping and toning that draws me in.

Oh indeed it does - or it can. My sweetie studied artistic anatomy in art school and did a lot of painting, drawing and sculpting of nude male models from live models - most of whom were retired, aged, not in great shape; or were but, um...yeah....

Get myself out of the hole I'm digging myself in here...I think what you mention, shapes, tones, lines, are why I'm drawn to Sarah's face in the late seasons rather than her more rounded face in the early seasons. She's too thin in the late seasons but there's the planes of her face to play with, so much shadow and light. Early seasons Sarah is the same problem I have with Michelle (Dawn) - how to make icons without making their faces look like dumplings? *lol*

So, I think I understand. One needs surface planes and shapes to work with. That's why I thought an icon of Angel's face would be terrific to play with. *le sigh* next time.

so that one of Joyce was typical of that theory.

But it has a nice balance - the set of her mouth, her curls; and I liked the color you chose precisely because it's the color I asssociate with Joyce, neutrals - a warm camel or fawn color. Buffy wears the same color a lot but especially that long leather coat we see repeated in S7 - from Him to EP and End of Days.

Date: 2014-05-28 07:12 pm (UTC)
debris4spike: (Spuffy - Something Blue kiss)
From: [personal profile] debris4spike
It was worth not making a Spike icon to get a Spike GIF!!!

Yes, I have a real thing for shoulders and arms .... although add a nice smile and you definitely have a winner!

I'm not fond of "sweet" people ... so again I think that the softer lines of the girls, such as early Buffy, make me think of those characteristics. (I worked with someone who was so, so sweet .... while stabbing you in the back!)

Glad that the colour tones of Joyce worked ... but that was, as ever, guesswork .... I must be getting better at guessing ... LOL

Date: 2014-05-30 05:47 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] red-satin-doll.livejournal.com
It was worth not making a Spike icon to get a Spike GIF!!!

*lol* You are welcome! how about Joyce and Spike in Becoming:






I can appreciate what you mean about shoulders and arms. This week I've been working on my 20in20 icons of Buffy and I can (and have) spent hours on the architecture of Sarah's nose, brow, cheeks, etc; the bones just beneath the flesh, the way the curves and angles intersect. And I don't think she's that pretty or sexually attractive, but she's interesting to look at. Or hands - I love hands, and all the hand symbolism in the show. If I tried to explain it rationally, I couldn't.

Also, shoulders and arms come with hugs!

Date: 2014-05-20 12:32 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] snogged.livejournal.com
I love your posts on icon challenges. Not only do they remind me to vote for things, but they also are insightful and beautiful and fun to read.

Date: 2014-05-20 04:32 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] red-satin-doll.livejournal.com
Oh sweetie thank you so much; I'm so honored and grateful that you enjoy them!

And I am definitely indebted to folks here who pimp these things and provide links so I don't forget myself (and there is SO MUCH OUT THERE!)

Date: 2014-05-20 03:47 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] spikesredqueen.livejournal.com
There are always so many wonderful entries to vote for!

It sucks that she has to extend the round for OWL but now I will have time to do mine.

Date: 2014-05-20 04:30 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] red-satin-doll.livejournal.com
Good for you but sucks to be me this time! *lol* Can't wait to see what you come up with.

Date: 2014-05-20 07:26 pm (UTC)
From: [personal profile] kikimay
It was really hard to choose this time on slayerstillness. Beautiful, beautiful icons.

Date: 2014-05-20 11:35 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] red-satin-doll.livejournal.com
It was really hard to choose this time on slayerstillness.

If I could vote a second time, there are about five I'd happily give "best color" to, and perhaps best crop. Maybe my third place vote. first and second place I'm comfortable with.

Between us chickens - I loved some of the Buffy/Angel icons this round.

Tuesday, May 20

Date: 2014-05-21 04:51 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] livejournal.livejournal.com
User [livejournal.com profile] rahirah referenced to your post from Tuesday, May 20 (http://su-herald.livejournal.com/723756.html) saying: [...] Behold the icontest pimpage and icons most excellent [...]

Date: 2014-05-21 12:10 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] bangel-4e.livejournal.com
Thank you honey for promoting the comm...and I didn't do anything, if I can help let me know :)

Date: 2014-05-21 12:18 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] red-satin-doll.livejournal.com
You answered my questions, you sent me an email - you did lots, trust me! I appreciate that a lot.

(BTW - I don't know why I had to unscreen your comment to reply to it, this thread isn't f'locked or anything. Oh LJ how you bedevil me.)

Date: 2014-05-21 12:23 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] bangel-4e.livejournal.com
Thank you <3 It was my pleasure :)
Ahahah, don't worry...sometimes it happens.

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