"Welcome to the Hellmouth" / "Bring on The Night"

[red_satin_doll]

"You're standing at the mouth of Hell. And it's about to open up." *

***
"I'm beyond tired. I'm beyond scared.
I'm standing on the mouth of Hell and it's going to swallow me whole. And it'll choke on me." **

* Joss Whedon
** Marti Noxon & Douglas Petrie

Comments

[lanoyee.livejournal.com]

'splainy please? (I should write a dictionary of online/LJ acronyms sometime. just to jog my own memory.)

Ohgod, I see I use way too many speech quirks/patterns from my own online social circle with you. /laughs

So, anything like "sdljfdslfjaödf" is called a keysmash, and it is something me and my friends often use to denote excitement, bafflement or similar emotions. It is created by literally hitting random keys.

NGL means "not gonna lie".

YESSS! SING IT! This gets missed so often in fandom; and Tara's supportiveness of Buffy in DT and saying that Spike "He's done some good and he does love you" gets misinterpreted into the notion that Tara is basically a Spuffy-shipper.

Really? That is... slightly odd. I mean, Tara's way not invested enough to ship it. She's basically being a great friend pointing out the positive in the situation to reassure Buffy that it's not that wrong of her to feel as she does.

And the whole "Tara and Spike have a special bond" trope - is that just fanon (and if so, whatever floats the boat) or do people read that in canon?

That's a trope? Wow. Things I didn't know. Though I did once read a very... interesting Buffy/Tara/Spike three-way fic. (Yes, really.)

BTW - I know I said I don't "ship" Buffy and Tara - but then I was looking at caps of them yesterday in OAFA and Hell's Bells and I suddenly thought that, y'know, I could 'ship them, in a strictly non-canon kind of way. ;)

And I think I could get down with that. ;) You know I said I basically ship Buffy with everyone. So I'm actually okay with completely out-of-the-blue Buffy pairings, as long as they interest me and don't gross me out. Buffy/Wesley is surprisingly a favorite.

But yes, indeed, and again I'm willing to be compassionate - I can understand why, and it's been building ever since Willow told Cordy that the delete button the keyboard meant "Deliver".

It's definitely been building up, and it's quite fascinating! I still kind of like/want to like Willow, as well -- just, some of her actions definitely make me go "uhhh". The way she treated Tara is among those.

in contrast to a more IMO "mutually abusive" depiction of Buffy and Spike.

Agreed. The abuse going on there is definitely mutual, and I think that's an important point because a lot of people are quick to wholly blame one or the other.

And it's complicated - I see my mom and her husbands in W/T, and my (lesbian) partner and myself more in B/S - NOT in terms of any physical hitting or fights but just in terms of arguments and verbal spats.

Ugh, I'm sorry to hear that. :(

But it's not always that simple, either. I mentioned that to someone one time and I think I offended them (they feel about Willow the way I do about Buffy); and I didn't mean to do so; but just using the word "abuse" (like rape) is triggery.

That's true -- one's gotta be careful about one's language concerning these issues. We all make mistakes, though, and unintenionally offend other people; I've done it often enough. :/

I sometimes question if I'm not letting that ep get away with too much, or what my laughter says about me that I might not like knowing

Ohh, I know that feeling! I know it well, sob.

If you mean me, I apologize; I only meant to describe my reaction, not proscribe yours. Sometimes I shouldn't use words.

Oh, no, I didn't mean that at all! I was just... doing the same thing, I guess. Describing my own reaction. You didn't offend me at all, and I'm sorry if it came off that way!

[red-satin-doll.livejournal.com]

So, anything like "sdljfdslfjaödf" is called a keysmash

Oh, ok!

Really? That is... slightly odd. .

I have seen that in a lot of fics and conversations: the perception that Tara is ok with Buffy being with Spike, by virtue of the comments you mention, and I think also in comparison to the other Scoobies. Or at least to Xander, I don't recall Willow being judgemental of Spike in the same way that Xander is, but Xander has some "masculinity issues" that could sink the Titanic. & this is related to the Spike & Tara have a special bond trope shows up a lot: Tara defends Spike in front of the other Scoobs, Spike begrudgingly admits that she's a "bit of all right" or something. Joyce is portrayed similarly; because she's respectful & sometimes friendly to Spike & treats him like a person, is interpreted to mean she'd be cool with him being Buffy's boyfriend. I don't think that the text supports that. if she were alive in S7 she MIGHT be ok with Buffy and Spike being together; I'm certain she would not be cool with their relationship in S6. Then again if Joyce had been alive, the last two seasons would probably have been very different.

I think Tara & Joyce are used in some circles to claim the superiority of "their vampire" over the other; I'm not sure how much if any of that is genuine interest in Joyce and Tara themselves. Although there are the Tara/Spike shippers so I'll assume genuine interest there. I don't think I've ever actually read a story that shipped B/S/T but I'd be curious to read your's.

So I'm actually okay with completely out-of-the-blue Buffy pairings, as long as they interest me and don't gross me out. Buffy/Wesley is surprisingly a favorite.

I read a Buffy/Charlie Dunn story once that I really liked. I noticed you have Buffy/Wesley crossed out in your comment, 'splainy? I've read a couple of B/W stories and they were ok, except for one that goes AU after the end of S6 that I found a bit uncomfortable and degrading to Buffy. I got the feeling the author didn't like Buffy, and her behavior made no sense to me. So I haven't read any of that pairing since.

just, some of her actions definitely make me go "uhhh". The way she treated Tara is among those.

Oh yeah, I won't try to excuse or condone her actions either, any more than Buffy's or Spike's or Angel's or...anybody's basically. YMMV. Speaking of Willow I was watching bits of Earshot and surprised how much foreshadowing of S6 there is in it; I was comparing it overall to Normal Again but there's a scene where Willow interrogates Jonathan as a suspect & goes on about fantasies of control & being noticed; then later she says "That slippery little weasel I had him in my grasp!" OMG: cue Dark Willow. It's brilliant; all those moments in the early seasons that seemed cute or inconsequential end up having so much weight.

The abuse going on there is definitely mutual, and I think that's an important point because a lot of people are quick to wholly blame one or the other.

IKR? BTW I hope I wasn't getting too triggery for you mentioning my partner & myself; it's not a horrid relationship by any means; there's just a dynamic there & in my mom's relationships that help me understand what happens on BtVS; things make sense to me for specific reasons; I don't have a lot of academic theory to hide behind because it's mostly very real world stuff. I probably need to be more careful though.

We all make mistakes, though, and unintenionally offend other people; I've done it often enough.

Yep. Then I'll feel bad afterward; & hopefully I can apologize & it'll all be cool; most times it is. But there have been other times-have you ever been left feeling at the end of a conversation, WTF just happened? Not sure if you were crazy and irrational or the other person was? I hate that feeling.

Describing my own reaction. You didn't offend me at all, and I'm sorry if it came off that way!

No worries! I tend to go back and forth I think between oversensitive and not sensitive enough; and sometimes it's hard for me to read between the lines, so I'll default to "my bad". But that is such old, old training in me that it's a habit, unfortunately.