red_satin_doll: (Chosen One - purple)
red_satin_doll ([personal profile] red_satin_doll) wrote2013-03-15 08:35 pm

Buffy the Vampire Slayer 2 x 11: "Ted"


Originally posted at the Jossverse Big Damn Love Fest: http://big-damn-fest.dreamwidth.org/3818.html


RUNNER-UP: Best Meta (Not Fade Away) category of the Wicked Awards Round 10
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***
Warning and Disclaimer: I have thoughts - and a lot of feelings - about "Ted".  This is quite serious, and more than a little personal; some very triggery subjects will be discussed. I’m not kidding. If this isn't your thing, by all means feel free to hit the back button right now, and no hard feelings.  If you chose to continue otherwise, considered yourself welcome as well as forewarned. But please leave your weapons at the threshhold before you come in. Then wipe your feet on the mat, and help yourself to cookies.  (Or hot cocoa with extra marshmallows.) Also, I apologize for the formatting but LJ is being very disobedient tonight.

Joyce_Buffy_Sad_ Ted_LJ_500pixels

And then there's the simple truth that when you engage in violence, accidents happen. We aren't robots. We can't turn off and turn on with the flip of a switch--and if we could, then we'd be okay with murdering people to gain our own ends. That fact that Buffy's violence is motivated by love is essential; it is both dark and light--she dances on the razor edge and she only has her instincts to guide her. - [livejournal.com profile] angearia
http://2maggie2.livejournal.com/33960.html

***
In 1958 Lana Turner’s 14 year-old daughter Cheryl Crane stabs her mother’s boyfriend to death, allegedly in an effort to protect her mother.  (The man, Johnny Stompanato, had gang connections and a history of violence behind him.)  The court rules it justifiable homicide.


***


Thirty years later another teenage girl, oldest of four siblings, reads about Cheryl Crane, admires Crane’s courage, and wonders if she would be able to do the same, if the need arose. Her (second) stepfather is a large and powerful man; her mom is barely 5’3”.  Would a baseball bat be sufficient?  A kitchen knife? She decides on a rusty WW1-era bayonet and hides it by her bed. Her mom finds it and removes it without a word.


***


In the end, it’s unnecessary anyway; her mom divorces her husband and her daughter can breathe again, a little, and home becomes a safe place to be for the first time in years. It’s not that the girl wanted to hurt her stepfather.  She knows that would be a horrific act; she also knows that there are people out there, other girls, for whom such things are unimaginable.  But she’s been surrounded by violence her entire life, and so it’s not off the table. What is unimaginable in all her dark reveries, risking death for the sake of her family, is the notion of defending  herself from her stepfather. Not once does that occur to her.
***
In 2012 the same girl, now a woman, finally watches Buffy the Vampire Slayer for the first time. She enjoys the cleverness and subversion of the “high school is hell” metaphors, the witty dialogue, the genre tropes and subversions. She is entertained and amused, even moved at times, but she doesn’t really identify with the pretty, perky ex-cheerleader at the center of the story.  It doesn’t really touch her own experiences, and isn’t remotely scary, even when Buffy goes down to meet her death at the hands of the Master for the first time. (There are a total of seven seasons, after all; ergo, nothing to worry about.)


***


And then the woman watches “Ted” and for a few moments, she is terrified - for Buffy, and for the girl who hid a bayonet by her bed all those years ago. Memories she’s (thought she’s made) made peace with and packed away tumble out unbidden, like an overstuffed dresser drawer.  She knows that her experience is not identical to Buffy’s, after all, and there’s a relief in that; the girl she once was couldn’t fight back, couldn’t protect her herself much less her family, and never even dared to protest or sass back; Buffy can, and does. She has resources that girl of long ago, and most abused children, can never dream of - confidence, physical strength, strength of character and will, resourcefulness, as well as devoted friends who come to her aid.


***


But Buffy Summers is just a girl, after all, a 16 year old girl operating on instinct. She’s been given a “license to kill” (demons) and almost zero guidance in how to use it.  The Watchers’ Council cares nothing for her welfare, or for the countless girls who have preceded her; what matters is that the Slayer does her job properly and follows the arcane rules imposed upon her, traditions handed down through the centuries.
BuffyFrightened_Ted_LJ_300pixels
Ted Buchanan, as it turns out, would make an ideal Watcher by the Council’s standards, barring his use of physical violence, and even that’s not a sure thing. After all, the original Shadowmen chained a girl and forced the power of the demon upon her; the Watchers' Council may be more “civilized” on the surface, but they uphold a terrible tradition. The Slayer is used, discarded and replaced when she rebels or no longer suits the councils needs. Surely more personal abuse and violations of Slayers by individual Watchers is not beyond the pale.


***


Likewise Ted demands obedience from a string of women, discarding and destroying them when they disobey him or are no longer useful. How many Slayers throughout time have come before Buffy (later Kendra and Faith)? How many other people has Ted hurt or killed, women who wouldn’t follow the program, in addition to the four wives in his closet?  The Watcher’s Council and Ted both operate within closed systems; they may allow minor changes and adjustments so long as the original paradigm is preserved.


***
Of course Buffy defeats Ted, motivated not just by her Slayer instincts but the instincts of a daughter and friend to protect the people she loves. She’s the Hero, after all. And yet she suffers for her actions; social ostracization, guilt, and shame. Heros may not end up in court charged with justifiable homicide but there are still consequences to bear. (There are always consequences.)


***


Or at least there are if the Hero is a teenage girl. Violence from men is so common as to be unremarkable; violent acts committed by women are still considered shocking. It’s no accident that at the end of the episode Buffy and Joyce agree to a rewatch of Thelma and Louise, a movie that disturbed and polarize audiences because two female protagonists commit violent acts against male characters onscreen; the same violence by male protagonists is a commonplace in movies, and a guarantee of box office sales.


***


So Buffy succeeds but at a cost.  Her mother is safe but heartbroken and terribly lonely, unable to even look her daughter in the eye. Whatever her personal animosity towards Ted, much of it justifiable in light of his behavior, the last thing on earth Buffy ever wanted to do was to hurt her mother. The bond between them, one that suffered fissures long before “Ted Buchanan” came into their lives, is further damaged.  And yet they love one another, deeply, no one questions that, and there’s the rub.  The anger and love are warped and woven into one another so tightly that what poisons their bond also strengthens it.


***


And so it is with her best friends, with her mentor, with everyone who comes within her circle. Violence begets violence. It stains and spoils everything it touches; it cannot be put back into a tidy little box, locked up and tossed away.  We can atone for it but we cannot undo it.


***


But this a fictional story and in fiction, unlike real life, there must be some catharsis for the viewer, a chance to release the anxieties the story has provoked, to relax and breathe again. And so it is for the characters themselves, or at least it seems at the moment.  The episode ends happily, one might say conventionally, enough. More dramatically than the story of girl with the bayonet, perhaps (real life has no resolutions, remember); but Buffy and her mother come to an uneasy, unspoken peace on the back porch, their home (women’s space) reclaimed, and they can breathe again, for a time. Rupert Giles and Jenny Calender share a passionate kiss for the first time, Xander and Cordelia giggle while Buffy averts her eyes. It’s an ending worthy of Shakespearean comedy: All’s well that ends well.
JoyceGiles_Kiss_Ted_Cropped_LJ.Brknscrncps

Except, of course, that we’ve seen the entire series, and we know too much. The moments that made us smile and cheer when we first watched are painful now. (Not as painful as the memory of that bayonet and all it represented, but certainly poignant.) The characters onscreen have the luxury of perpetual innocence; they can’t know yet that Buffy will hesitate to kill her lover and it will cost Jenny her life, and Giles his only chance at love; that Buffy will eventually run a sword through her lover’s heart. The truth of Buffy’s calling will be forced upon Joyce at the worst possible hour and their relationship will be very nearly destroyed.


***


Much has been made of Buffy’s “daddy issues”,  at the cost of the complex mother/daughter relationship, and so scholars and fandom inadvertently repeat the sins of Ted Buchanan, and of the Watchers Council.  We forget, dismiss or overlook the fact that it always comes back to this: the love between a girl trying to grow up in an uncertain and frightening world, and a lonely mother so deeply in denial she cannot see what’s in plain sight before her eyes.


***


And Ted’s fingerprints (do robots have fingerprints?) can be found in the final hours of Buffy’s story when Giles and “General Buffy” and their friends represent the last vestigal traces of the WC, haunted by ghosts and locked into a closed and destructive paradigm. Violence begets violence.


***


In 2012, Buffy became my Hero - by which I mean my fictional hero, my avatar, as opposed to real life heros such as my mother.  (Make no mistake - in her capacity to love and endure, I consider my mother heroic.) My brothers grew up with Spiderman and Batman and Hans Solo; with countless tales of soldiers and kings throughout the ages. I had to wait until I was in my 40’s to find her.


***


Was it worth it the wait? Yes, it most certainly was. Yet I can’t help feel a little wistful that Buffy Summers wasn’t around in the 1970's or 1980’s; I certainly would have loved her then as I do now, if perhaps for different reasons. I can hope that in the years since that at least one other girl or boy, etched with anger and violence, haunted by dreams of murder that are so common as to be unremarkable, has felt just a little less frightened and alone because of her.

[personal profile] kikimay 2013-03-16 01:09 am (UTC)(link)
I'm glad that that girl didn't have to use her weapon but I really can understand her desire to do it. I think she was really really strong to just survive and become an intelligent and free person. And, yes, I felt also shocked when I read many comments in the ex Buffymaniac, now Serialmente, in which everyone is upset about Buffy's violent reaction and no one is upset about Ted's abusive behaviour. I wish that all the girls in this world could react as Buffy did because sometimes it's really about surviving, especially when a man hits you. So yes, the audience overlooked Ted and overlooked abusive men in BtVS mostly because I believe that we overlook them in RL. We are so used to them that we forget.
I loved the meta and I loved Angearia's quote at the beginning - so perfect - and I'm sending you a big bear hug. Because of reasons.

[identity profile] norwie2010.livejournal.com 2013-03-16 04:33 am (UTC)(link)
You made me tear up....

Much has been made of Buffy’s “daddy issues”, at the cost of the complex mother/daughter relationship, and so scholars and fandom inadvertently repeat the sins of Ted, and of the Watchers Council.

This. So, so this! The WC personified by Giles tries to break up the matriarchal home of the Summers women, in fact, he tries to replace Buffy's mother with himself. And while he loves Buffy, he does not love her unconditionally - he tries to shape her in ways which benefit his agenda, the ideology he stands for; as opposed to Joyce Summers, who - while sometimes confused - loves her daughter wholly. There is some aspect of proprietary love - or 'love' as a special expression of ownership - vs a mother's love here. And, yes - fandom, critics, whathaveyou are all too dismissive of the female relationship (and not only this mother-daughter relationship!) and put overly focused importance on Buffy's relationships with (various) men.

Thanks for writing this! And all the very best to you! :-)

Friday March 15th, 2013

[identity profile] livejournal.livejournal.com 2013-03-16 04:49 am (UTC)(link)
User [livejournal.com profile] audela referenced to your post from Friday March 15th, 2013 (http://su-herald.livejournal.com/643083.html) saying: [...] has thoughts about Ted [...]
snowpuppies: (Default)

[personal profile] snowpuppies (from livejournal.com) 2013-03-16 05:36 am (UTC)(link)
Wow. Beautifully done, and you highlight something that really encompasses not only Ted, but the series as a whole - there is something for everyone. Something that touches us, speaks to us, resonates in our lives. It's the reason that people are still hanging onto this fandom after so many years.

In a way, your story reminds me how I feel about The Body, which I think it truly my favorite episode. Although my grandmother didn't pass suddenly like Joyce, the bright and raw pain, the shock, the gaping hole created in the character's lives so closely echoes what I feel, even years later, when I think about my grandmother. And that's why it speaks to me. And I cry every time I watch it, and actually usually enjoy doing so.

Thank you for sharing your story and your thoughts.

[identity profile] ever-neutral.livejournal.com 2013-03-16 08:55 am (UTC)(link)
I love everything about this post.

It’s no accident that at the end of the episode Buffy and Joyce agree to a rewatch of Thelma and Louise, a movie that disturbed and polarize audiences because two female protagonists commit violent acts against male characters onscreen; the same violence by male protagonists is a commonplace in movies, and a guarantee of box office sales.
Oh wow, I completely forgot about this part in the episode. What a brilliant catch. ONE OF MY FAVORITE MOVIES FOR A REASON. <<<333

And yeah, I don't understand how anyone could possibly watch "Ted" and not sympathize with Buffy. I mean, how UNACCEPTABLE for a woman to fight back against her abuser with everything she has. SMH.

In conclusion: You speak to my soul. And thank you especially for sharing your personal experiences -- I can imagine that must have been incredibly difficult, but it's definitely appreciated, especially by those of us who have also grown up in abusive homes. {hugs}

♥ ♥ ♥

[identity profile] snogged.livejournal.com 2013-03-16 02:59 pm (UTC)(link)
This was marvelous!

I really enjoyed that you talked not just about "Ted," but about "BtVS" as a whole.

I also want to thank you for sharing your story.

[identity profile] mcjulie.livejournal.com 2013-03-16 03:42 pm (UTC)(link)
What a great post!

I'm sorry that you ever had to suffer in a violent household, and glad things got better.

I think I mentioned this in the late Season 5 polls, but I think fans don't always understand how important Buffy's mother is to her, because she's never been important to the fans in the same way. But their relationship always rang really true to me. Joyce is a lot cooler than my mom, and my parents never split up, but I still feel like I get their relationship. Mom is young and pretty enough to sometimes seem like she's competing with you on your territory. Mom loves you, but she doesn't understand you at all. She tries to lay down the law sometimes, because she thinks that's what good parents do, but it's always at the worst possible time in the worst possible way. Sometimes she screws up seriously. Sometimes she'll even admit to screwing up. But in the end, you love each other, and you're there for each other.

I actually like this episode quite a bit -- it's clumsy in places, but the central metaphor (Mom is dating a creepy, abusive, deceptive sociopath and I'm the only one who seems to see it) works for me.

The mini golf scene rings particularly true -- she gets bored, so she cheats to put a quicker end to things, the guy catches her and displays his Norman Bates side, and later Mom is laughing, "he caught you cheating, didn't he?" and right there you can so easily imagine the version of the story he told Mom. Everyone wants to think "the truth lies somewhere in the middle" -- liars know how to take advantage of this.

Ted is an early exploration of some of the themes that will come back later in the Warren/Buffybot storyline -- I don't know if the association between robots and misogyny is a deliberate reprise, or just where the creative team's minds tended to go. Joss is just a bit older than I am, and I like to imagine him growing up watching The Bionic Woman with its "fembots."

[identity profile] itsnotmymind.livejournal.com 2013-03-16 03:53 pm (UTC)(link)
Excellent post. Very compelling. Thank you for sharing your story.
shapinglight: (Default)

[personal profile] shapinglight 2013-03-16 06:23 pm (UTC)(link)
Thank you for sharing.

Ted is not a favourite ep of mine by any means. I always want to shout at Joyce, "Don't you see what he's doing?" I think it's the one time in the entire show she really lets me down, even though her wanting what Ted appears to be offering is quite understandable.

Joyce is my avatar, you see. Probably because when I first saw the show, I had daughters approaching Buffy's age.

[identity profile] beer-good-foamy.livejournal.com 2013-03-16 09:49 pm (UTC)(link)
Thank you for posting this - both for sharing, and for the brilliant meta. I love the way you tie this into the bigger themes of the series - the explicit parallel between Ted using and using up women and the WC doing the same honestly never struck me, at least not this blatantly.

Violence from men is so common as to be unremarkable; violent acts committed by women are still considered shocking.

Oh yes. (I'm reminded of the extreme reaction last year when there was a one-woman performance of the SCUM Manifesto on stage here in Stockholm; the reaction it received from a lot of men who were apparently thoroughly freaked out by even hearing about it was... depressing to say the least.) I think there's an interesting commentary within "Ted" on the notion of women using violence; even the cops immediately assume that Buffy must have hit back ("Things get outta hand. He's a big guy.") Even when faced with evidence of women being able to fight, it's assumed that they are the objects of violence, capable of fighting back when you put them in a corner but never having agency over their stories. In a lot of ways, "Ted" is a classical horror movie with Buffy as "final girl" - Buffy viewed through the lens that Ted and the cops use. The violence isn't just physical.

their home (women’s space) reclaimed

I'm still not sure what to make of the fact that Buffy kills Ted with a frying pan. It's either awesome or cringeworthy.

Anyway, thanks again for sharing this. I'm so sorry you had to go through that. Hugs if you want them.

[identity profile] http://users.livejournal.com/mazal_/ 2013-03-17 02:02 am (UTC)(link)

Definitely an excellent post pointing out some incisive parallels.

This may seem a bit prosaic by comparison, but I also think the character Ted can be thought of as one more in a long list of "bad dad" figures we see in both BtVS and in A:ts

I love Joss for that, and I would really like to know where it comes from.

[identity profile] infinitewhale.livejournal.com 2013-03-17 02:02 pm (UTC)(link)

Very interesting piece of analysis. I have to admit I'd never given much thought to Ted in this context before, but now that you point it out, it does seem rather blatant, particularly the Ted/Council stuff.

[identity profile] comlodge.livejournal.com 2013-03-17 09:24 pm (UTC)(link)
Childhood horrors. How they shape, ruin, direct, challenge our entire adult lives, leaving hauntings that lay supposedly dormant that jump out from time to time and yell boo, frighten then run away for a little while. Never gone, untalked so fester quietly, sometimes not so. Parents so badly needed, sometimes so badly wanted but not.

You made me cry, made me remember, made them say boo.

[identity profile] eilowyn.livejournal.com 2013-03-17 11:29 pm (UTC)(link)
This is tragic, but almost lyrical in the way you not only wrote it, but how you presented it. For a girl to seriously contemplate striking out at a dangerous stepfather is not something you hear of often, but you do hear of it.

******SPOILERS FOR LOST BELOW. SKIP TO THE BOTTOM ASTERISKS TO AVOID******

This is Kate Austen's story. I'm doing a Lost re-watch right now, and when I read your meta she was the first character who came to mind. We first meet Kate when she sews up a gash in Jack's side with a nervousness that will later seem foreign to her. By the end of the first three episodes, we know she is a fugitive, and that the U.S. Marshall who was bringing her back from the States had "Don't trust her! She's dangerous!" as his dying words. It isn't until episode 2.09 that we finally learn what Kate did, why she always runs, and why she's always so weary, manipulating situations out of caution rather than malice. She's the girl who finally did turn on a bad stepfather, and her mother is the one who turned her in after Kate killed him. These two wounds are carried by the character until the final episode. In flashbacks, flash forwards, and the flash-sideways that come in season 6, the wariness of someone who had to take it upon herself to be proactive when her mother wouldn't lays heavy on her.

*****

Check out Lost. I think you'll find some familiarity in the story of Kate Austen, who, like Cheryl Crane, took fatal action against a man who mistreated her mother.

I haven't seen Ted in a long time, but to me it was always the episode with the guy from Three's Company, not a cathartic recognition of the self as a child. I don't envy you your experiences, but I admire your willingness to share them.

[identity profile] eilowyn.livejournal.com 2013-03-17 11:30 pm (UTC)(link)
their home (women’s space) reclaimed

I'm still not sure what to make of the fact that Buffy kills Ted with a frying pan. It's either awesome or cringeworthy.


You two are so damn smart. I'm going to be thinking about this conclusion for the rest of the day.

[identity profile] angearia.livejournal.com 2013-03-18 06:11 pm (UTC)(link)
Thank you so much for letting me know about this meta. I've been out of touch with fandom of late, so I'm so grateful to have read this. Your writing here -- it's beautiful and brave and powerful. It left me shaking with emotion.

In 2012, Buffy became my Hero - by which I mean my fictional hero, my avatar, as opposed to real life heros such as my mother. (Make no mistake - in her capacity to love and endure, I consider my mother heroic.) My brothers grew up with Spiderman and Batman and Hans Solo; with countless tales of soldiers and kings throughout the ages. I had to wait until I was in my 40’s to find her.

This. So much this. Beautiful. Seeing how much you love Buffy just brings it all back to me even stronger. Thank you. ♥

[identity profile] red-satin-doll.livejournal.com 2013-03-20 01:01 am (UTC)(link)
Thank you so much for letting me know about this meta.

I'm not sure if that was gratitude for inspiring me or shamelessness on my part, but of course I had to let you know. Your words - your unflinching courage in speaking your truth - inspired this, have frequently inspired me, so if I can give back even a little in return, I'm pleased.

Your writing here -- it's beautiful and brave and powerful. It left me shaking with emotion.

Oh, Emmie, I am stunned - and honored.

Seeing how much you love Buffy just brings it all back to me even stronger. Thank you. ♥

*hugs* I've said before that NO ONE loves Buffy as much as you do, IMO, so this coming from you leaves me speechless. You have no idea.


[identity profile] red-satin-doll.livejournal.com 2013-03-20 01:06 am (UTC)(link)
Childhood horrors. How they shape, ruin, direct, challenge our entire adult lives, leaving hauntings that lay supposedly dormant that jump out from time to time and yell boo, frighten then run away for a little while. Never gone, untalked so fester quietly, sometimes not so. Parents so badly needed, sometimes so badly wanted but not.

You made me cry, made me remember, made them say boo.


Oh hon, THIS, every word of this - you made me crying reading it. You just said in a few short sentences what took me paragraphs to express, made something beautiful out of terrible ugliness and pain. I hope I haven't made it hurt too too badly. (Can I offer a hug?)

[identity profile] red-satin-doll.livejournal.com 2013-03-20 09:06 pm (UTC)(link)
Thank you thank you sweetie - I had a feeling you would appreciate it. I'm sending hugs back - no reasons necessary, just because. And Angearia had so many wonderful things to say about that episode I could barely begin to pick the "right" quote - any one of twenty would have done equally well.

I felt also shocked when I read many comments in the ex Buffymaniac, now Serialmente, in which everyone is upset about Buffy's violent reaction and no one is upset about Ted's abusive behaviour.

The same attitude on American sites - we talked about this on your LJ a little before - is what inspired me to write this entry. (I was originally going to write about "Him" for the Big Damn Love Fest.) And that attitude was prevalent even on a site with an openly "feminist" orientation. "Feminist" does not mean we all believe the same thing, of course; but the attitude that "Buffy went over the line" was not only nearly-universal, but it became the focus to the exclusion of everything else in the episode.

This episode fits very neatly with the themes of the season, but it's still a show about a girl in high school, it's touching on a lot of the themes and tropes common in RL as well as movie and high school movie genres. I watched it the first time wishing that Buffy could just relax and give the guy a chance, let Joyce have someone in her life - until the scene at the mini golf course. The moment he threatens to slap her is when everything shifts for me, and I think the episode communicates that. The musical cues are suddenly ominous instead of comedic, the extreme close-up of Ted's and Buffy's faces conveys the sense of threat and danger, of coming too close into her physical space - crossing boundaries, just as he does verbally with the threat and physically later in her bedroom.

And if the theme is that of "power and responsibility (and misuse of it)" how can we focus on Buffy's "misuse" of her Slayer powers, and not talk about the fact that, like I said, the WC's abuse of power in making her a Slayer, in appointing Giles her Watcher; about Joyce's abuse of power in bringing a dangerous man into the home (and I say that as someone with great sympathy for Joyce); and most especially Ted's responsibility to NOT harm, terrorize, control and threaten other people? I'd say Buffy is still the most responsible person in the entire episode.

And her "killing" Ted here is NOT analogous to Faith stabbing the Mayor's assistant in S3, IMO. I don't think the show is saying the two acts have the same meaning so much as fandom conflates the two - it's a contrast, not a parallel. Buffy was fighting to protect herself and her mother's lives.

[personal profile] kikimay 2013-03-20 10:59 pm (UTC)(link)
I completely agree on every point: the stabbing of the Mayor's assistant is enterely something else, something really tragic but in a different way and for me it wasn't about Buffy killing a human (even if he really wasn't, but you know what I mean ...) the episode, to me, was majorly about this character abusing Joyce and Buffy.

[identity profile] comlodge.livejournal.com 2013-03-21 12:53 am (UTC)(link)
:) Love the hug thanks, very precious. Sending one back to you. We are the sum of our experiences. We can't deny them. We can only learn to live with them, cry a little when we have to and grow beyond them. Take care:D

[identity profile] red-satin-doll.livejournal.com 2013-03-21 03:06 pm (UTC)(link)
Last night I hit the "comment" button before I replied to the second half of your comments, hon:

I wish that all the girls in this world could react as Buffy did because sometimes it's really about surviving

The notion that someone doesn't have the right to defend themselves against an attacker/
abuser is abhorrent to me. I disagree slightly in that I wish that it wasn't an issue for anyone, period. It's best not to get into a relationship with someone abusive but you can't always know going in if someone will do that. We tend to be at our best at the beginning of a relationship, just as Ted is to Joyce at first; we only see his charming side, and it's very seductive.

It's best not to engage or get into that situation but human beings are violent, period. Check the history books and the newspaper - it's not going away any time soon. And that puts the burden on the victims rather than the perpetrators to change. No one goes into a relationship consciously thinking "I want to be abused and risk injury and death on a daily basis." And I suspect that very few people go in thinking "I want to hurt and terrorize the people I love." Abusers tend not to see what they do as abusive; from my experience both abuser and abused are wounded children in adult bodies who haven't fully (or even attempted to at all) processed their own hurts, their wounds; and taking it out on someone else, or enduring it, was what was modeled to them by their own families of origin.

And lostboy pointed out in his meta "Rules of Engagement", in RL most abuse victims are physically weaker than their attackers - fighting back isn't even an option. In most instances it's best not too engage - but that is often not an option either (if you leave the house, where do you go? For most people there are no shelters nearby, or they don't know the location of one.)

especially when a man hits you

I'd say that the gender of the abuser doesn't matter; abuse is abuse, full stop. (I have two brothers and sister.) At the same time, I agree with this statement:
So yes, the audience overlooked Ted and overlooked abusive men in BtVS mostly because I believe that we overlook them in RL. We are so used to them that we forget.

Statistically, women are more likely to be raped, injured and killed by someone they know - usually a male family member or partner - than by a stranger. That's certainly true in the US and dollars to donuts says that's true in your country as well. Men have fought most of the wars in human history. tv shows and movies are filled with countless protagonists who are no less violent than the villains and whom we're supposed to cheer on.

Ergo, we are immune to it because it's been normalized. Women are supposed to be the "peaceful" ones, the "nurturing" ones, so when women commit acts of violence, onscreen or RL and regardless of the context or motive, it's considered shocking and abnormal, monstrous even. (Women aren't even supposed to be angry.)

Ironically, I've noticed this line of thinking exists among both feminists and anti-feminists. (Women should be "assertive not aggressive", if women ran the world it would be a more peaceful place, Buffy crossed a line, blah blah.) And that's bullshit, IMO. I think it demonstrates a lack of understanding of the dynamics of violence and human psychology. It implies that men cannot be changed (boys will be boys) and it's up to us women to do it, to show the way.

That's why I think it's really brave that in S6, Willow abuses Tara - and I've gotten a lot of flak for that view from people who love and who hate Willow. I think it's brave that they went there because women do abuse other women, as well as men. Some lesbians are in abusive relationships, but that's not acknowledged because it doesn't fit the stereotypes of women or lesbians. And lesbians have perpetuated that stereotype, for what I think are obvious reasons.

[personal profile] kikimay 2013-03-21 03:35 pm (UTC)(link)
I agree again.
And when I wrote "when a man hits you" I wasn't talking about genders but really about something much stronger than you who hits you. And, of course, not all the men are strong. There are men thinner and weaker than a woman and, in that case, the woman has a fighting chance. But let's consider a man like Ted and a girl like Buffy in the real world: without supernatural powers Buffy is a skinny and petite girl. What's her fighting chance against a man like Ted in a case of physical attack? Realistically he would win against her and that's it.
Of course there are many ways to abuse somebody. Sometimes isn't about brute force at all - see the Willow and Tara's situation - and those are the times in which men and women are really on the same ground because a woman can be psychologically abusive as much as a man. But again different circumstances and different type of victims.

[identity profile] red-satin-doll.livejournal.com 2013-03-21 04:23 pm (UTC)(link)
Hey sweetie, I'm so glad you came by! I was hoping you would, I've missed seeing you about lately. Still working hard in the belly of the beast?

When I first watched the show I was frustrated by how little we see of Joyce, to the point that she literally disappears (from the screen) in S4, because I know how complicated that mother/daughter bond is - I lived it, and still do, as someone with a divorced mom, from a "broken home" as the saying goes. You depend on one another, and the parent/child roles transfer back and forth between you. I have more sympathy for my mother's experience now as an adult in a long-term relationship. And that seems strange given that motherhood is as much subtext as fatherhood on the show - Buffy becomes Dawn's mother, and she and Faith become the "mothers" of the new line of Slayers (the Slayers have two mommies!), they "sire" the new army. And sisterhood and motherhood are not really separate but part of a continuum IMO - which I think the transfer from Joyce-Buffy to Buffy-Dawn acknowledges.

Watching the show increased my sympathy for my mom and her experience, but mostly via S6; Buffy's isolation and weariness, financial struggles, her untreated depression etc reminded me both of my mother and myself. (Of course, right?) But I was hungry for some of those issues to be acknowledged or touched upon in while Joyce was still alive; the story is from Buffy's POV so maybe that's realistic, but there's no sense of the financial difficulties for instance; we never see Joyce working or paying bills; she might as well be wearing June Cleaver's pearls. I also wanted her to "see" who Buffy was, to become part of the story rather than on the periphery of it, the butt of the joke. Joyce apparently has no trauma whatsover from Helpless that we can see, and the fallout from "Gingerbread" is never dealt with or acknowledged between the two of them, the way it is here in "Ted". And I think that's sloppy, or careless/thoughtless writing & plotting.

You can imagine how disappointed I was when Joyce disappeared from S4 and how happy to see her come back in a big way in S5; add Dawn to the mix and the importance of female (and familial) bonds was very important to S5 and I loved that...and then they killed off Joyce.

It's all the more irksome that as there were "father figures" aplenty on the show but very few mother figures. There was no one to replace Jenny or Joyce when they were killed, no other mature women figures, except Maggie Walsh, who I was hoping would become a mentor to Buffy but turns out to be a villain. And the one prominent female Watcher on the show also turns out to be a villain. For all the show's girl power/feminism etc, mature women still do not exist, or they are erased quickly.

To the show's credit, Joyce lingers as a "ghost" in S6-7 (in NA, in her photograph, as the First) so the bond is still acknowledged, but again there are no other mature women whom Buffy relates to. I think that's a "blind spot" in Joss's thinking/worldview because, again, it's been normalized.

Because I have too many thoughts for one reply...

[identity profile] red-satin-doll.livejournal.com 2013-03-21 04:51 pm (UTC)(link)
[Con't]And while he loves Buffy, he does not love her unconditionally - he tries to shape her in ways which benefit his agenda, the ideology he stands for; as opposed to Joyce Summers, who - while sometimes confused - loves her daughter wholly. There is some aspect of proprietary love - or 'love' as a special expression of ownership - vs a mother's love here.

As an agent of the WC he definitely tries to replace Joyce, which has probably been normal procedure in many cultures and throughout time (i.e. Kendra, or Nikki's Watcher adopting Robin.) Giles' ambivalence represents the fact that he paradigm no longer works in the modern world. At the very least needs to be rethought or adjusted. It's that closed system that allows minor tweaks but no major changes. But that's not to absolve Giles or Joyce of their failures either.

I think it's a bit more complicated than "proprietary love vs motherly love", which implies that women and mothers especially just intuitively know how to love and intuitively have "mastery". It's gender essentialism, which I don't believe in (see my comments to kikimay above). I'm sure you know the Victorians had a particularly strong and sentimental "cult of the Mother", and we see that acted out with William and Anne in FFL, in today still in fandom's collective memory of Joyce, as well as Buffy and Dawn's memories of her. Giles claims that Joyce taught Buffy "everything you need to know about life", a convenient rationalization! Buffy says to Dawn in "Him" that she's glad that Mom is not around to see Dawn dressed and behaving like a "slut", conveniently forgetting her own dress and behavior in S1-3, and before that in the Bargaining flashback. I think the appearance of "Saint Joyce" in CWDP is actually a parody of this idea; LMPTM criticizes both Spike and Robin's failures to see their mothers as anything but extensions of themselves.

Joyce also has expectations and desires of her daughter, just as Giles/the WC, even if it's somewhat less explicit. That's partly to do with the fact that the writers are less concerned with Buffy-Joyce as with Buffy-Giles, but also because she's more "careful" in expressing her own expectations. "I don't want to be disappointed" Joyce says in one episode (an "I" statement), as opposed to DreamHank in "Nightmares", "you're sullen and rude..." ("you" statements.) Joyce's confusion and anger once she learns the truth in Becoming is understandable; but she also fails to see the truth all along, the blood stains, etc, doesn't try very hard to understand what's going on with her daughter, which is good and bad; she's trying to be a "modern" parent, almost but not quite a "friend". Her boundaries and discipline is haphazard (she grounds Buffy for rather minor infractions, but allows her daughter to walk the obviously older "college boy" in "Angel" to the door to say goodnight.) She brings a lover into the house who turns out to be a dangerous, violent man; her need and desire are understandable but she nonetheless puts her child and herself in danger.

This somewhat haphazard pattern actually strikes me as pretty realistic of many parents, esp in dysfunctional families (I actually hate that term but it's a convenient shorthand); but I don't think Joyce is immune from the criticism the show makes of authority figures and especially parents. Power and abuse of power is a major theme of the show, and "abuse" includes neglect (Sheila Rosenberg), denial (Joyce) and abandonment (Giles). Failure to protect the innocents is just one expression of the theme. People say that Joss has a thing for "bad dads" but I prefer Cynthia Bowers' term in this context, "problematic parenting" because it encompasses both genders.

And honestly, I think the phrase "unconditional love" is problematic itself. It implies that there's a "right way to do" love, and whatever doesn't match the description is wrong, we're getting it wrong, at least in terms of interpersonal relationships (as to opposed to a more abstract "love for the world".) So I think we keep missing the love that we do have and feel, that's right in front of us, in the search for the "right kind of love". (Riley in S5, and Buffy and Spike in S6 being prime examples.)

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