red_satin_doll | Tsunami of Polls #1 : Any interest in a comm devoted to Buffy and the women of the Buffyverse?

#1 - Thank you to whomever gifted me with a temporary paid account last month. Now I can create polls! Oh wonderful Anonymous Benefactor, you have no idea what you have unleashed upon this fandom.

#2 - Thanks also the the lovely

velvetwhip for coming up with the insanely awesome title/tag phrase "tsunami of polls" and allowing me to snag it.

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The other day I was having a conversation with

wickedbish in which I may have mentioned that most fandoms and fandom activity, in my experience, are focused primarily on the male characters. I assumed this was common knowledge. Except that he didn't know that. Because, you see, Ryan's favorite character is Willow (see #2 in his list of "13 Witches I Fucking Love"); he still mourns Tara (as do I; shared grief is comforting) and Buffy is one of his heros. The Gift has convinced him to not commit suicide "so many times". He's all about the ladies, bless.

You know what they say about "assuming".

Oops.

Then

clockwork_hart1 (Lucy) popped into the conversation and in her brilliant, enthusiastic way suggested the idea of a comm dedicated to Buffy, the other women in the 'verse and their interrelationships - complete with a name (Summers Blood) and a banner (she's working on it - is there no end to the young woman's talents?) ~~and three-part harmony~~. What that might actually look like or what interest there would actually be in such a thing was a matter of conjecture. So I'm channeling my inner Willow (Research Gal) for my very first poll.

What say you, Gentle Reader? Based just on the title of this post, you probably know who you are and how you stand.

(And as this is my first poll, please let me know if it functions ok. And I apologize for the wonky formatting. The LJ instructions for poll-making are vague and confusing at best. So says I.)

[Poll #1955410][Poll #1955410]

Flat | Top-Level Comments Only

See, I love Cassie a lot. She popped into my head 'cause I was talking to Kelsey about how Dawn is gay in my headcannon (like she is in hers) and I said I thought she had a big crush on Amanda - then I remembered Cassie, and I was like - she was in LOVE. The way they connected so immediately, the way she fought so hard... It's actually more painful to think about it in that light - and I think they would have made an adorable couple. So she just popped into my head and so I thought I'd mention her. And your points about Marcie Ross, Sunday (vamp from The Freshman) and Shelia - did she get a last name? - are totally valid. Awesome characters, if only for one episode. (I think I'd have liked a little more of Sunday than a lot of the Initiative arc, to be honest, because it was so heavy handed, and she slipped in so well - we still remember her). And Veruca, the werewolf girl that Oz fell for could have been more interesting if we'd gotten a little more out of her - but Seth Green leaving kind of killed that.

I have the same issues with Willow as you, I think - she's never "my" Willow again after.. well, after Tabula Rasa, actually. And as for Tara, well, let's just all be thankful that she never got the chance to get ruined (as awful as that is, maybe it was a blessing in disguise?)

But like you say, were all still talking about it - were all still here. And maybe that's the best legacy we ever could had hoped for.

Azura Skye's performance was amazing. Like the Buffybot, Cassie could have gone wrong in so many ways and ended up being so RIGHT. I've rewatched Help and sobbed when she's explaining to Buffy that she can't help her but she appreciates it anyway. And when Buffy is crouched over her body at the end. (TELL ME AGAIN BUFFY IS A CLOSED-OFF BITCH Y'ALL.)

The way they connected so immediately, the way she fought so hard... It's actually more painful to think about it in that light

I can go either way on this (I tend to think of Dawn as "omnisexual" or "whatever no big deal" and I've shipped her post-series with Faith in my own writing.) I think it's tragic whether we see them as friends or potential partners who never were. (And in friendships I think there is often, initially, an amount of "crushing" that goes on.) But, Dawn/Cassie? I'd never thought of that before and now I WANT THIS FIC. THIS MUST HAPPEN. If Buffy and Cassie relate as girls who "don't have a future" because they are fated to die young (so they think), so would she and Dawn re: her experience in S5. And OMG Cassie and Dawn going to the dance together? YES PLEASE.

did she get a last name?

According to imdb she was billed as "Sheila Martini" which sounds just stupid enough to be real. (Really Joss? Not only is she a bad girl compared to the golden girl Buffy because she's sexually active - Xander calls her a slut - and because she's working class, but we HAVE to tack on the implication of alcholism there as well?)

I just have a LOT of feelings about Sheila and I'm too chicken-shit to put them up here in a journal post. I remember watching School Hard and thinking, well if I wasn't aware of Joss' regressive madonna/whore concepts of female sexuality before I am now. And then looking back at screencaps and rewatching the ep and remembering that she's kidnapped, tied up and tossed in a corner of Spike and Dru's bedroom until he takes her out for Dru to "eat" and the poor girl is TERRIFIED. I know horror movies are full of those sort of tropes (teen sex = death and punishment) but it's not being subverted or questioned here at all.

Then the claims that a certain blond vampire *ahem* would never torture anyone, etc don't sit well with me because we do see the evidence. what Sheila endures is psychological torture at the very least, possibly physical because she was overpowered, tied up and gagged. Sheila is a reminder that vampires are MONSTERS, not cuddly pets. But she's a disposable plot device and thus completely forgotten. Even I'd forgotten about her until I was having a conversation with

itsnotmymind a few months back.

I think I'd have liked a little more of Sunday than a lot of the Initiative arc, to be honest, because it was so heavy handed, and she slipped in so well - we still remember her

YES. She reminds me a little of other characters who reflect who Buffy once was in Hemery High, or are an inversion of Buffy (esp. Cordy & Glory). Sunday is the leader of her own little "gang" as Buffy is with the SG and was back when she was a "mean girl".

but Seth Green leaving kind of killed that.

Pun intended? I've read that Joss was planning on killing off Oz in S4 so Willow could go scary-veiny anyway. WHY couldn't Seth have stayed a little longer if he was going to be killed off anyway? Veruca could have been the one who killed him, or the Initiative. And then Tara could have LIVED, damnit! (Think about it - Giles finally spirits Willow away to the coven where she meets another young, gentle witch.) Or they could have shipped Willow and Riley because they totally had chemistry, killed him off and avoided the ugliness of cheating on Buffy; then introduced Tara. It could've been perfect. Birds, stone.

she's never "my" Willow again

I have issues with the Snark Squad girls take on Willow in S7 for this very reason. They go along with the story's romantic tragic version of "poor Willow". And the person who suffers the most in the long run for it at least in fandom is...Kennedy. http://fandomforequality.com/2014/01/31/ladies-who-need-more-love-kennedy-buffy-the-vampire-slayer/

And maybe that's the best legacy we ever could had hoped for.

Bringing it back round to the positive? You're a goddess.

Oh and I made a couple of Sheila icons the other day to help ease my pain:

I like to think of it as "fannish creativity as social protest".

See, Cassie and Dawn is the most adorable thing! I meed to rewatch Help. Maybe it could kick the muse into gear? *prays*

For a show that was born from the idea of shooting down the horror tropes, that episode kind of employs them in spades. The Madonna/Whore thing is something Joss needs to get the fuck over, though. But, so do most writers. I shame Joss for it because this is a show I feel should know better, but if no one else is employing it... (except maybe Lost Girl, which is about a bisexual Succubus and sex is thoroughly enjoyed by all and never to anyone's detriment, and it's not exclusively tied to undying love blah blah blah).

The torture of Sheila is intrinsically tied to that of Dru by Angelus and Darla in the monastery, too. It's the same thing. Forced to watch two monsters fuck before being eaten alive by them - and god knows what else was actually going on.

Pun intended indeed. And interesting AU (which probably shouldn't be an AU, but there you go - to be honest though, I do quite like Oz, and he got some great lines and he was pretty much the only guy in the whole series I didn't rampantly hate at some point)

And yeah, I've had my fair few issues with the snark squad girls of late. My feelings on S6 and 7 seem to differ quite a lot from thiers. And that Kennedy post? THANK YOU. I needed that in my life! See, I never hated her and actually, she's responsible for one of my favourite fics I've written (Through Dirt was a cathartic thing for me to do), and all of this just makes me like her more. If we'd have had more time, it may have come to more, but look; she was gay, she was a POC and she didn't die or run away. That's fucking impressive considering Joss' MO. Just sayin'

And I always like to bring stuff back to the happy. It's not all doom and gloom in the Buffyverse - I could stand to remember that.

Sorry, butting in...
I've read that Joss was planning on killing off Oz in S4 so Willow could go scary-veiny anyway. WHY couldn't Seth have stayed a little longer if he was going to be killed off anyway? Veruca could have been the one who killed him, or the Initiative. And then Tara could have LIVED, damnit! (Think about it - Giles finally spirits Willow away to the coven where she meets another young, gentle witch.) - OMG, that's the first time I hear of this rumor. This is such an interesting possibility! Where's the fic? Now I want all the AUs! *_*

OMG, that's the first time I hear of this rumor. This is such an interesting possibility! Where's the fic? Now I want all the AUs! *_*

Right? Maybe those fics are in a Willow/Tara shipper happyland IDK.

Tsunami of Polls #1 : Any interest in a comm devoted to Buffy and the women of the Buffyverse?

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